39 replies to this topic

[usermom]

Hi, here.

I’m a parent of Btech student who’s been desperately trying to change her program since last week. I would not bring it up, but it’s getting extremely annoying and we both are totally distressed. To be specific it is about getting into AP class she applied in June and which …requires 2 of the following 3 criteria be satisfied:

• Minimum of 85 cumulative……. average
• Minimum of 85 cumulative…… average
• Teacher recommendation.

It is not mentioned at all if here is a competition and if so about possible denial. My daughter meets two requirements and one of them is highly above. How come she is not in that AP class as she found out the first day of school? Why she is supposed wait for so long to get a response if she got there or not, and if not, why? Why things like that could even happened? Why not to inform students about their acceptance into AP’s in June (as it was promised). Why nobody can clearly explain what is going on? (I spoke with GC and the answer is always “I don’t know”). Why to put the student who worked her a$$ out to get into this class in such stressful situation? She doesn't deserve go through this and been treated this way. I don’t want to hear this usual song“ our schooool is soooo big”, sorry, I don’t buy it anymore, we have had enough last year. Does anybody care that if even she gets somehow (I actualy doubt it) in that class they probably are far ahead and it’s hard to catch up. What is the particular purpose of all this crap? What actualy to do? How to boost the process? How to find out what is going on?



sorry for my english

[Becca95]

Students were actually informed about their AP acceptance in June through their student emails, they received an email if they got into an AP course they applied for. If your child did receive the email, they should speak to the Guidance Counselor about it. If you child didn't receive an email in June, then they didn't get into the course. It will be extremely hard to get your child into the AP if they didn't in June plus, schedule change period has already passed.

[usermom]

Thank you.

I'm referring previous thread "Honors/AP Class Acceptances?" posted on July, where kids are saying:" And yea, we find out if we made it in or not on the first day when we get our schedules".
Besides, the whole system is not clear. Like classes requirements. How it works? Lets say they first accept students with 86/86/ and teacher's recommendation or they prefer students with 95+ for main subject and teacher's rec.? How to find out if my child was just unlucky or here is a mistake. If she was not accepted why her GC took her program changing request on Tuesday, why she would do so, why did not just tell my daughter "you did not get there", that all. Why she keeps saying "I dont know" for every single question we ask even now when schedule change period has passed. Is here any possibility that something went wrong?

[DBest]

Well, the classes they show us in June are not permanent. Those are the possible classes we can take. I got into Judo and AP spanish on the program sheet they gave me in June, but when I got my program sheet for senior year none of those classes were listed. You're able to take the class through merit, but you'll get in depending on the availability. My major made it impossible for me to take Judo, as for AP Spanish, I had to adopt a 1-10 no lunch to fit that into my schedule. The classes are also full to capacity (~35 students), and apparently it is illegal to have more. It's near impossible to switch into a class that is full to capacity. Somebody in that class has to drop out, or you need a miracle.

[usermom]

There is no major that interferes so far. Ones again. Why nobody bothered to inform my daughter that she is not good enough, why they keep her waiting. What actually we are waiting for? Classes are full, changing process is over but she visits her GC every day to hear “I don’t know” again and again. So GC still has no idea if class is full or not. Situation is even worse than I expected.

[NickC]

If you believe your daughter should've been admitted into the class and if your daughter believes so as well because she meets the requirements, then submitting a program change is all she has to do. If she has not received a response yet, that is because the programming staff is still working on her request instead of just outright saying no -they are working hard to find a spot in a class that will fit her schedule. There are over 5000 students in the school and glitches do happen during the programming process. It is done through the computer not manually and individually by student.

The lovely thing about Tech is that they try to program students who WANT APs into those classes - granted that there is room of course. Tech likes seeings students challenge themselves to take higher level classes and take on a more challenging course load.

Just hang on tight. The GC would not know either because GCs don't make program changes - the staff in the programming office does. GCs just fill in the paper work and send it down to the programming office. Has your daughter received a notification of the status of her change? Meaning, whether or not she was denied the change?

[SoLR]

usermom, on 20 September 2010 - 09:15 PM, said:

There is no major that interferes so far. Ones again. Why nobody bothered to inform my daughter that she is not good enough, why they keep her waiting. What actually we are waiting for? Classes are full, changing process is over but she visits her GC every day to hear “I don’t know” again and again. So GC still has no idea if class is full or not. Situation is even worse than I expected.

Which AP did your daughter apply to? As Nicky mentioned, if she put in a request for a program change and it hasn't been denied than the programming office will be working very hard to get her into the class that she wants. However, if all of the classes are completely full and no ones dropping anything than it'll be impossible for her to have a spot.

[usermom]

I do believe that my daughter should be there, her previous teacher believes it too, and even assistant principals of that department confirmed her eligibility. I don't see how it helps if no spot in the class. Her changing request has not been denied so far but how it helps if no spot in the class.

I also wish to know how exactly they fill out these classes. Who are their first/second/third priority?

If classes are already full should not they already know about it. Waiting until someone drops is ridiculous. I also believe that this process should've been done in June including class placement /program changing etc. assuming how big the school is. We are not supposed to be in such stress because somebody has no idea how to run big school. You probably get used to all this, however it shouldn't be this way. IMHO.

Sorry, I prefer not to say what AP it is for some reason.

Thank you guys anyway.

[usermom]

NickC, on 20 September 2010 - 09:41 PM, said:

The lovely thing about Tech is that they try to program students who WANT APs into those classes - granted that there is room of course. Tech likes seeings students challenge themselves to take higher level classes and take on a more challenging course load.

I see.....

[NickC]

It's impossible to do programming in June because teacher assignments are switching throughout the summer. Programming is done in August when everything is finalized for the new school year. Last minute changes always happen and it throws off the entire process.

A lot of students who are qualified apply for classes all the time and are rejected because their program just doesn't have the capacity to fit the class in and/or the class is entirely full.

Like I said, hang on tight, the programming office is working on it since she did not receive any word yet.

[usermom]

Of course its obvious that the whole world is not fair however there is no reason to lay down and die and do nothing to make things work better. Or at least try. There is always a cure.

First: There is definitely lack of information. How the heck we should have known if AP placement process is not automatic for those who meet reqs. The school's website has tons of useless information and there is nothing about how the acceptance process is working.

Second: Disorganization. Someone above mentioned that some students received their placement by email in June (Even saying this is impossible due to teachers programming etc) Some students say they found out when get their schedule at first day of school. And even worse if student got his placement in June which was not permanent (?!) and then different one in September which might be also changed. In my opinion this is nothing just a mess. It makes no sence at all. Too complicated for me.

Third: If nothing works for the individual's needs here (for deserving individual btw) I don't think if the individual person would ever care about anything at the school. The problem here that whenever the school wants the individual to do something FOR SCHOOL's needs it perfectly works and shows big deal of effort and outstanding organizational skills. (no offence though)

Does anybody know if it is possible to transfer to another school during sophomore year?

[NickC]

You can transfer which ever year you want but I guarantee you will not find another school like Tech.

[l33t]

usermom, on 21 September 2010 - 12:32 AM, said:

Of course its obvious that the whole world is not fair however there is no reason to lay down and die and do nothing to make things work better. Or at least try. There is always a cure.

First: There is definitely lack of information. How the heck we should have known if AP placement process is not automatic for those who meet reqs. The school's website has tons of useless information and there is nothing about how the acceptance process is working.

Second: Disorganization. Someone above mentioned that some students received their placement by email in June (Even saying this is impossible due to teachers programming etc) Some students say they found out when get their schedule at first day of school. And even worse if student got his placement in June which was not permanent (?!) and then different one in September which might be also changed. In my opinion this is nothing just a mess. It makes no sence at all. Too complicated for me.

Third: If nothing works for the individual's needs here (for deserving individual btw) I don't think if the individual person would ever care about anything at the school. The problem here that whenever the school wants the individual to do something FOR SCHOOL's needs it perfectly works and shows big deal of effort and outstanding organizational skills. (no offence though)

Does anybody know if it is possible to transfer to another school during sophomore year?

I don't think that not getting into one AP class warrants changing your child's school. That class is not going to make or break her high school career, and it will not determine whether or not she gets into a good college. Good students are able to excel under any academic circumstances. As long as your child gets great grades (even if the class is not AP), everything will be fine. Again, one AP class is not a big deal, no reason to get distraught over it.

[R. Asher]

Let me clarify a few points that may help clear things up:

• Students are given a tentative schedule in June to make sure the course placements and requests are accurate.
• Qualifying to take an AP class does not mean placement is automatic, it still depends on seat availability and period alignment.
• The actual formal placement of students into the classes is automated by the DOE programming system and only after the master schedule is implemented can we make the changes that are possible.
• First priority in programming is given to 9th grade students followed by 12th grade students with specific needs for graduation. The program staff then works through the huge pile of requests to accommodate those that are easily implemented.
• A deep analysis of students wishing to drop electives (senior math, language) or change levels from AP to Honors or Regular is then done to determine available slots for students who want into those classes.
• This process takes several months at most schools and less than two weeks at Tech. The program team works long hours to try to put through the changes as soon as possible - sometimes it just isn't possible.
• For a more specific case, contact the AP Guidance (Ms. Bonds) or my office (Mr. Asher).

I hope this helps -

[usermom]

l33t, on 21 September 2010 - 05:43 AM, said:

I don't think that not getting into one AP class warrants changing your child's school. That class is not going to make or break her high school career, and it will not determine whether or not she gets into a good college. Good students are able to excel under any academic circumstances. As long as your child gets great grades (even if the class is not AP), everything will be fine. Again, one AP class is not a big deal, no reason to get distraught over it.

Based on her performance she could choose 3 AP classes and she picked only one she likes the most with the highest grade and the biggest possibility of been granted even if the placement process is not clear. Epic failure. Now she is devastated and has no motivation to learn especially assuming she was denied only because she is not a big fish in a small pond as she could be at another school. And, yes, it might affect her future career. Besides, she is bored up to tears in her current regular class which doesn't match her level, learning things she's already known.

AP course should not be an award. It's a part of right to education which shall be equally accessible to all on the basis of merit.

[usermom]

R. Asher, on 21 September 2010 - 05:51 AM, said:

Let me clarify a few points that may help clear things up:

• Students are given a tentative schedule in June to make sure the course placements and requests are accurate.
• Qualifying to take an AP class does not mean placement is automatic, it still depends on seat availability and period alignment.
• The actual formal placement of students into the classes is automated by the DOE programming system and only after the master schedule is implemented can we make the changes that are possible.
• First priority in programming is given to 9th grade students followed by 12th grade students with specific needs for graduation. The program staff then works through the huge pile of requests to accommodate those that are easily implemented.
• A deep analysis of students wishing to drop electives (senior math, language) or change levels from AP to Honors or Regular is then done to determine available slots for students who want into those classes.
• This process takes several months at most schools and less than two weeks at Tech. The program team works long hours to try to put through the changes as soon as possible - sometimes it just isn't possible.
• For a more specific case, contact the AP Guidance (Ms. Bonds) or my office (Mr. Asher).

I hope this helps -

1. Did not get any schedule in June.
2. Really? Why not to mention about it in school policy how about to make school policy for dummies/freshies. Still have no answer who has the priority to enroll.
3-4. Thank you, it's clear now.
5. Ok. Now what. Are we waiting untill someone drops his/her AP in which slot we need, or here is already available slot. Is it too difficult for GC (or someone else) to determine?
7. It's clear now she did not make it I have no power to investigate why and dont care about it anymore. Case closed.

Thank you.

[SoLR]

usermom, on 21 September 2010 - 09:23 AM, said:

1. Did not get any schedule in June.
2. Really? Why not to mention about it in school policy how about to make school policy for dummies/freshies. Still have no answer who has the priority to enroll.
3-4. Thank you, it's clear now.
5. Ok. Now what. Are we waiting untill someone drops his/her AP in which slot we need, or here is already available slot. Is it too difficult for GC (or someone else) to determine?
7. It's clear now she did not make it I have no power to investigate why and dont care about it anymore. Case closed.

Thank you.

Actually, I can confirm, as a student, that we all received a list of classes which we had requested in June. In regards to point 5, you really ought to contact either Mr. Asher or Ms. Bonds. Both of them have far more power and resources which can be used to look into this. Also, rather than just going to the guidance counselor, it's always a good idea to stop by the programming office or speak to the AP of the department which is in charge of the class that she's trying to get into. The programming office is under a lot of pressure, and I've even had friends receive revised schedules today. If you don't wish to pursue this any further than that's your call, but contacting Mr. Asher or Ms. Bonds would be the best thing to do in your situation. I've just noticed that you mentioned that your daughter met 2 of the 3 requirements. Meeting the requirements qualifies you for a spot but that doesn't mean that it's 100% guaranteed. There may have been other students, with higher averages, meeting all 3 of the requirements that got picked over her.

[l33t]

An AP class is not a right, it is a merit-based privilege. They are by no means mandatory for every student, and no student is entitled to them automatically. 75% of Brooklyn Tech's sophomores probably have an average over 85 and meet all of the criteria for AP enrollment. Limited funds and resources mean that only those with the highest grades and most merit get in.

And I can ensure you that taking AP European History/AP World History versus a regular history class will not make or break anyone's career. (I took it, and I'm probably not becoming the President when I get older.) It's just one class. Big deal.

[Noldi]

But anyway yeah, APs do not make or brake anyone's life. relax.

[MaiAndy]

I know for a fact that many schedule change requests are still pending. Many of my friends still did not get their schedule change back.
That also doesn't mean that they will get a change on their schedules.
I would also have to add that it's just an AP class. I had a situation last year where I did not get 1 AP but I already had 2 others to juggle. I would consider myself lucky not getting that 3rd AP.