53 replies to this topic

[Shadburn]

My Fellow Seniors,

If you have any questions regarding Mr. Asher's policy, please direct them here. Senior Government is fighting for you, and we will be active on this forum answering any questions you might have.

David Shadburn
Parliamentarian Class of 2011
Council of Student Activities Coordinator

[R. Asher]

David and the other members of student government will compile and forward concerns but I would like to directly post the current policy.

To participate in the extracurricular senior activities, students must satisfy three criteria:

• Appropriate Disciplinary Record: If the Office of Health & Safety (Deans) ban you from an event due to disciplinary issues, you may appeal to me but only the most extraordinary of circumstances would convince me to overrule.
• Appropriate Academic Standing: Students may not be failing more than two classes and must not have any grades of 0 or 45.
• Attendance at Senior Information Night: Since this event is conducted on school time, attendance is mandatory. Students who miss the event will be required to make up the session with me at a time & place to be determined prior to participating in any of the events.

The time/place is TBA until Mr. Williams, Mr. Kaelin, and I can review the attendance list and determine the number of students involved (review should happen on Wednesday this week - no time to do it before the Open House). Once the volume of students involved is determined, the session will be scheduled.

[Shahruk]

This school has gotten out of control.

1)I used to be a large supported of this school and would defend it endlessly, but now I have nothing to be proud of.
2)I heard the latest time they can LEGALLY keep you in school is 4 PM.
3)Why would any seniors go to an event for a school they no longer care about? In addition, my friend who swiped and left knew everything I learned by wasting 2 hours to attend senior information night. We sat there and read the pamphlet out loud.


-We've seen the same SGO execs, just in different positions. Obviously nobody cares enough...
-You're practically forcing to pay us $10 to the school. No, we're not going to fail if we don't pay $10 but I worked for 4 years.
-The student community does not show up to dances or school games.
-The communication in the school is TERRIBLE. Students find out about things before teachers.
-The school day was extended (still searching for a reason as to why).
-SGO is pretty darn.....inefficient. Nothing happens for practically a year, they only talk about it.
-The school uses the Class of 2011 Facebook group as a means of communication. This is the biggest joke ever.
-WHY am I ESCORTED out of school after 8th when I have practice after 9th? Why do I not feel like a student of the school but rather a guest? There is no homely spirit. There is no "one office" where I can go to get every single question answered or redirected.
-Highly unused auditorium
-All these issues about money are ridiculous.
-You're not giving seniors planners. Honestly? Seriously? I'd rather have my planner than useless smart boards.

Do you see where I'm going with this? There's all these shortcomings. Where does Tech stand out? Nowhere. When my friend will argue that Townsend Harris is a much better school than Tech is, and when my local zoned high school has more school spirit and a fully functioning body than a specialized high school, I can do nothing but admit they're right.

These criticisms aren't directed at any one person or group. Fix this school, bolster some spirit and love, and maybe, just maybe, the body will work with you and not against you.

Just my .02.

[Sulate]

Shahruk, on 17 October 2010 - 04:53 PM, said:

This school has gotten out of control.

1)I used to be a large supported of this school and would defend it endlessly, but now I have nothing to be proud of.
2)I heard the latest time they can LEGALLY keep you in school is 4 PM.
3)Why would any seniors go to an event for a school they no longer care about? In addition, my friend who swiped and left knew everything I learned by wasting 2 hours to attend senior information night. We sat there and read the pamphlet out loud.


-We've seen the same SGO execs, just in different positions. Obviously nobody cares enough...
-You're practically forcing to pay us $10 to the school. No, we're not going to fail if we don't pay $10 but I worked for 4 years.
-The student community does not show up to dances or school games.
-The communication in the school is TERRIBLE. Students find out about things before teachers.
-The school day was extended (still searching for a reason as to why).
-SGO is pretty darn.....inefficient. Nothing happens for practically a year, they only talk about it.
-The school uses the Class of 2011 Facebook group as a means of communication. This is the biggest joke ever.
-WHY am I ESCORTED out of school after 8th when I have practice after 9th? Why do I not feel like a student of the school but rather a guest? There is no homely spirit. There is no "one office" where I can go to get every single question answered or redirected.
-Highly unused auditorium
-All these issues about money are ridiculous.
-You're not giving seniors planners. Honestly? Seriously? I'd rather have my planner than useless smart boards.

Do you see where I'm going with this? There's all these shortcomings. Where does Tech stand out? Nowhere. When my friend will argue that Townsend Harris is a much better school than Tech is, and when my local zoned high school has more school spirit and a fully functioning body than a specialized high school, I can do nothing but admit they're right.

These criticisms aren't directed at any one person or group. Fix this school, bolster some spirit and love, and maybe, just maybe, the body will work with you and not against you.

Just my .02.

Mostly agree but without the hostility :P

The school day was extended in response to regulations set by the DOE

[Chiyeung DjChi Lau]

Barring students from extracurricular for any reason, aside from dealing harm or danger to other students, is absolutely ridiculous.

It will make students feel even worse or care even less.

[Shahruk]

^+1 Like

[JR85]

This wasn't what we were told prior to the event. We had no punishment before the event.


The events were unreasonable. We had to wait 2+ hours between the end of school, and the beginning of Senior info night.


The school LIED to kids about not being able to leave early from senior info night. When you have kids LOCKED UP, how will they behave?


Asher. Your behavior is embarrassing. You're like a 5 year old child whining because things didn't go as planned.


If this event was SO important to YOU (and only you), why weren't you at the senior photo telling kids to be there?




Why weren't kids told they couldn't go to any senior activities if they didn't attend Senior Info Night?

[ClEMeNt]

Honestly, the only school spirit I felt was during the Freshman assembly. The ONLY time we cheered for something of Tech. And even then, I wasn't even sure if it was school spirit or not.
Shouldn't we have a mascot or something...? We should have Mr. Williams back on the announcements.

I agree with Shahruk's post. Without the hostility like Sulate.

[Shadburn]

Shahruk, on 17 October 2010 - 04:53 PM, said:

This school has gotten out of control.

1)I used to be a large supported of this school and would defend it endlessly, but now I have nothing to be proud of.
2)I heard the latest time they can LEGALLY keep you in school is 4 PM.
3)Why would any seniors go to an event for a school they no longer care about? In addition, my friend who swiped and left knew everything I learned by wasting 2 hours to attend senior information night. We sat there and read the pamphlet out loud.


-We've seen the same SGO execs, just in different positions. Obviously nobody cares enough...
-You're practically forcing to pay us $10 to the school. No, we're not going to fail if we don't pay $10 but I worked for 4 years.
-The student community does not show up to dances or school games.
-The communication in the school is TERRIBLE. Students find out about things before teachers.
-The school day was extended (still searching for a reason as to why).
-SGO is pretty darn.....inefficient. Nothing happens for practically a year, they only talk about it.
-The school uses the Class of 2011 Facebook group as a means of communication. This is the biggest joke ever.
-WHY am I ESCORTED out of school after 8th when I have practice after 9th? Why do I not feel like a student of the school but rather a guest? There is no homely spirit. There is no "one office" where I can go to get every single question answered or redirected.
-Highly unused auditorium
-All these issues about money are ridiculous.
-You're not giving seniors planners. Honestly? Seriously? I'd rather have my planner than useless smart boards.

Do you see where I'm going with this? There's all these shortcomings. Where does Tech stand out? Nowhere. When my friend will argue that Townsend Harris is a much better school than Tech is, and when my local zoned high school has more school spirit and a fully functioning body than a specialized high school, I can do nothing but admit they're right.

These criticisms aren't directed at any one person or group. Fix this school, bolster some spirit and love, and maybe, just maybe, the body will work with you and not against you.

Just my .02.

I'm not going to reply to all of this, but there are some things that I think need to be said. I'd like to be clear that I'm only stating facts, not opinions (or at least I'm trying to be as objective as possible)

1) The entire school day was shifted. Seniors arrived at noon, so it is okay for them to hold you.
2) Senior Information Night is flawed and we know that. While the system is set to be changed for next year, unfortunately its too late for this year. One idea was that it could become more of an event rather than just an assembly. That would most likely bring more appeal.
3) We have a lot of work as Tech Students, and I'm willing to bet that a lot of people feel that either they would do it if they had the time, or that they shouldn't have to step up and do the job of the government - that as students/citizens, they can just watch. However, you've also said that students (including yourself) don't love or even like the school - why should they be government members if other people who do love it will and will provide them the services they need? And actually the entire exec board has changed from Freshman to Senior Year.
4) Every college, no matter where you're applying, wants to see that you're participating in extra-curricular activities. The reality is that every activity needs some amount of money, for whatever reason. They do what they can by fundraising, but they also need money from Student Government. There is a Student Activities Fund that we distribute to clubs who request it based on demonstrated need, but the amount of money coming from there has been shrinking and shrinking. So why should you or anyone be able to participate in activities for free? The money Student Government has to support the clubs comes from the Student Activities Fund, but primarily from SGO Card revenues. And now the SGO card is useful instead of that piece of cardstock - a reform Student Government brought about for this year.
5) Your right. The student community DOES NOT show up for dances and games. Thats a problem. It goes back to school spirit, which comes from the school AND the students. It is the administration's, the student body's and the Student Government's collective job to raise school spirit, because all parties are involved. And it starts with people like you to rally together a group of friends to go to the next volleyball, basketball, or swim game, which are right after school AT SCHOOL! It couldn't be any more convenient.
6) The school day was extended based on DOE Regulations
7) For years, Communication has been an issue at Brooklyn Tech. That's why the BTHS email system was set up, as an attempt to overcome that. It's showing mild success, but it requires students and faculty to have an active interest in WANTING to know whats going on. Imagine how much more you would actually know if classes were actually quiet during the announcements. I'm not in the position to address concerns about the faculty. About the Facebook group - it is pathetic, and it will never be as reliable a source as information that is sent to your BTHS emails, or that is posted to the BTHS Website. Unfortunately, we don't have enough access to those mediums to convey information, so we do the first thing we can. However, if you go to www.bths.edu --> For Students --> Senior Info, that page is going to be used more frequently by Senior Government to convey information in a more official way.
9) School Safety is under the direction of NYPD, not the school. Their goal is to get kids home safely and to protect the interests of the residents of Fort Greene. Kids get mugged and jumped after school more often than you think, so they're doing what they can to move you. There may be other ways to achieve that than blowing a whistle in your ear until you move, but I'm trying to be unbiased here.
9) The auditorium gets really difficult to schedule for use later on in the year based on how often it's being used. If you have any suggestions for things that you think should happen in the auditorium, let me know, we'd love to have your input.
10) Blame Wall Street and the completely disfunctional NYS legislature.
11) Planners were always paid for by the Alumni Association, and because they're facing tough economic times as well, they had to cut the program. So because we know you guys like having planners, they're included in your Senior Dues (both packages - they're $5 a piece). Keep in mind that very few other high schools give out planners.


Finally, if Student Government didn't do anything, then I wouldn't be able to answer all of these questions. I'm all ears for complaints because I love this school even if most of us don't. I really do want to fix things, and the only way we can do that is with feedback from you, the students. So thank you for this, I'm happy to fill you in.

[Shadburn]

In response to everyone else, I'd like to remind everyone to please remain calm and mature on this forum. We're trying to get constructive feedback from you on how we can work with you and for you.

[Shari Ilyas]

Shahruk, on 17 October 2010 - 04:53 PM, said:

This school has gotten out of control.

1)I used to be a large supported of this school and would defend it endlessly, but now I have nothing to be proud of.
2)I heard the latest time they can LEGALLY keep you in school is 4 PM.
3)Why would any seniors go to an event for a school they no longer care about? In addition, my friend who swiped and left knew everything I learned by wasting 2 hours to attend senior information night. We sat there and read the pamphlet out loud.


-We've seen the same SGO execs, just in different positions. Obviously nobody cares enough...
-You're practically forcing to pay us $10 to the school. No, we're not going to fail if we don't pay $10 but I worked for 4 years.
-The student community does not show up to dances or school games.
-The communication in the school is TERRIBLE. Students find out about things before teachers.
-The school day was extended (still searching for a reason as to why).
-SGO is pretty darn.....inefficient. Nothing happens for practically a year, they only talk about it.
-The school uses the Class of 2011 Facebook group as a means of communication. This is the biggest joke ever.
-WHY am I ESCORTED out of school after 8th when I have practice after 9th? Why do I not feel like a student of the school but rather a guest? There is no homely spirit. There is no "one office" where I can go to get every single question answered or redirected.
-Highly unused auditorium
-All these issues about money are ridiculous.
-You're not giving seniors planners. Honestly? Seriously? I'd rather have my planner than useless smart boards.

Do you see where I'm going with this? There's all these shortcomings. Where does Tech stand out? Nowhere. When my friend will argue that Townsend Harris is a much better school than Tech is, and when my local zoned high school has more school spirit and a fully functioning body than a specialized high school, I can do nothing but admit they're right.

These criticisms aren't directed at any one person or group. Fix this school, bolster some spirit and love, and maybe, just maybe, the body will work with you and not against you.

Just my .02.

(I'm typing everything in a list order, not to sound sassy but just to organize the post)

1) In the event that Seniors weren't mandated to go, the distributions of pamphlets would have been less efficient or (looking at it from the administrations point of view) cut into class time. If a student didn't receive a pamphlet, who would get the blame? The school. In the end, the school gets the blame for keeping students in a "useless" event, or by running the chance of missing students when giving out pamphlets during the day.

2) I'd have to disagree with you on "no one coming to school dances" as the size of attendees has increased so much that dances must be held in the 8th floor gym rather than (much smalled) 2C3.

3) Someone else already responded about the extension of the school day, BTHS couldn't help that.

4) Uh...can I know what the "nothing" you're referring to is? As far as I know, events are taking place throughout the whole entire year that CSA (committee of student activities) is responsible for planning. I dont see any idleness in SGO.

5) Can you explain what you mean by being "escorted" out of the school after 8? You can simply go to lunch, the library, or other rooms granted you have permission.

6) "All these issues about the money are ridiculous" -- But we do still have money issues...so...I'm not sure what else i can say about that.

7) It was announced that the Senior Planners were being ordered, no? So I'm not sure where you're getting the whole "we're not getting planners" claim from. (unless i missed something?)

JR85, on 17 October 2010 - 05:30 PM, said:

This wasn't what we were told prior to the event. We had no punishment before the event.


The events were unreasonable. We had to wait 2+ hours between the end of school, and the beginning of Senior info night.


The school LIED to kids about not being able to leave early from senior info night. When you have kids LOCKED UP, how will they behave?


Asher. Your behavior is embarrassing. You're like a 5 year old child whining because things didn't go as planned.


If this behavior was SO important to YOU (and only you), why weren't you at the senior photo telling kids to be there?




Why weren't kids told they couldn't go to any senior activities if they didn't attend Senior Info Night?

1) No punishment was stated, but attendance was mandated. If anything, students were given the benefit of the doubt (or so it seems) so that a punishment didn't seem necessary to begin with.

2) I'm confused, if the administration "lied" about leaving early (which means students could leave early), how were students "locked up?"

3) The events were unreasonable and we had to wait 2+ hours after school, yes. But school also started 4 hours later, so the day wasn't as long as it seemed or that you're trying to make it seem.

4) I wouldn't go so far to call Mr.Asher embarrassing. I'm not sure where Mr.Asher was, however, Mr.Williams, Mr.Kaelin (i think?), and Ikra (Senior President) all commented on student behavior during the meeting. Do we seriously need 4 people to tell us to be quiet? Mr. Williams should have been enough, IMO.

I probably missed some topics i wanted to commit on, so sorry if I have to post an essay like this again.

[lpj86]

I don't understand why the senior info session couldn't have been during the psats. It matched almost perfectly with the projected time, and no one would mind going to school at a normal time. Also, the established sanction for not going was supposed to be it being market as a cut. A cut does not warrant banishment from student events. I also don't understand why it was projected as being a 3 hour meeting. I know a lot of people who live really far away from tech, who genuinely thought they could not afford to go. Several tech students have obligations at home, or had college events to go to. Why are responsible, harworking students being punished? Ill be frank, the only worthwhile information that was not in the panphlet was ashers speech, and many students didn't even listen to that anyway. This entire ordeal is profoundly unfair to the students, and in the end, I think it is only going to make the administration look weaker.

[Sanguine]

Just wanted to add, many of us don't have an active interest in what's going on anymore... because well... there's just too many information being sent to us, (too many repeats/reminders of the same events) too many long emails, that most of us lose track of what events are important to us and what aren't. Here's the great paradox, the more information we're receiving... the less attention we pay to each specific one. To be honest, I've only been skimmming all these long emails and facebook messages I'm receiving because well, it's just information overload.

I just wanted to say... there has got to be a better way of communicating. Not everyone has Facebook, and not everyone has the attention span or time to have patience to read a message with seemingly long endless paragraphs (hint hint). Is there no way to make them more concise? Or make them seem more interesting/amusing instead of serious/dull? And how about those announcements during 3rd period (though I think we all know THAT problem.)

I also wanted to point out, that we should've been informed DURING Senior Info Night of the things that were recently Facebook messaged INSTEAD of all those other things that were only repeated in the pamphlet (even though I do understand that you guys found out the same time as us... but isn't that just an excuse?). Why not take advantage of the fact that a lot of us were there willing to listen to something useful? Honestly, afterward I felt I hadn't learned anything useful except for dates and costs of the senior events.

[anton]

Concerning school safety in general: It is a sad joke. On Wednesday, there were police cars and officers around the building. Meanwhile, in Fort Greene Park, people got robbed and beat up after the senior photo. This is just ridiculous. Shouldn't school safety serve to protect students?

[Frederick PF Suleiman]

anton, on 17 October 2010 - 06:25 PM, said:

Concerning school safety in general: It is a sad joke. On Wednesday, there were police cars and officers around the building. Meanwhile, in Fort Greene Park, people got robbed and beat up after the senior photo. This is just ridiculous. Shouldn't school safety serve to protect students?

I was saying the same thing since my freshman year. All they do is text and tell you to go to class. Even Juanita did more than the security guards.

[NickC]

Shadburn, on 17 October 2010 - 02:52 PM, said:

My Fellow Seniors,

If you have any questions regarding Mr. Asher's policy, please direct them here. Senior Government is fighting for you, and we will be active on this forum answering any questions you might have.

David Shadburn
Parliamentarian Class of 2011
Council of Student Activities Coordinator

It is not something entirely new or out of the ordinary. But because the class of 2011 is in extreme shock that they must do well in school, must not have infractions, and must attend a mandatory assembly, the policy is now being dictated clearly. School is not a free for all.

[NickC]

JR85, on 17 October 2010 - 05:30 PM, said:

This wasn't what we were told prior to the event. We had no punishment before the event.


The events were unreasonable. We had to wait 2+ hours between the end of school, and the beginning of Senior info night.


The school LIED to kids about not being able to leave early from senior info night. When you have kids LOCKED UP, how will they behave?


Asher. Your behavior is embarrassing. You're like a 5 year old child whining because things didn't go as planned.


If this event was SO important to YOU (and only you), why weren't you at the senior photo telling kids to be there?




Why weren't kids told they couldn't go to any senior activities if they didn't attend Senior Info Night?

So as young adults, the only way to to convince you to do anything is to threaten you with punishments?

The event was suppose to go as planned, given that you followed the rules to just show up because it was a mandatory assembly built into the school day. You didn't even need to write a paper or do an assignment, you just needed to BE THERE physically.

If you knew enough to be at the senior photo, then I doubt that you didn't know about the senior information night being in the evening. It was publicized on the school website having BOTH the senior photo being one of the activities AND info night on the schedule for seniors.

There is a reason why Senior Information night is mandatory. Perhaps the word mandatory should've set off a few hints that you HAVE to go?

[NickC]

lpj86, on 17 October 2010 - 06:23 PM, said:

I don't understand why the senior info session couldn't have been during the psats. It matched almost perfectly with the projected time, and no one would mind going to school at a normal time.

Don't generalize for your entire class. In addition, a freshman assembly was being held during the PSATs which is why Senior Info Session could not be held during that time. The only place that can fit well over 1000 students at any given moment is the Aud.

In addition, parents were also suppose to attend Senior Information Night as well which is why we hold it in the evening so parents can come right to Tech to meet up with their kid. Senior year is expensive. We hold this assembly every year to keep you and your parents in loop and to tell you what to expect. This is a time for students to discuss with their parents which events they want to attend and ways to fund those events. I know my mom pushed me to get a part time job to pay off those events because she told me that she wasn't going to take a cent out of my college fund.

When was the last time you read something the school gave you? Sure you may say now that giving out the pamphlet would suffice for having to stay 2 hours, but if we just did that, do you know how many kids would come up to 7C1 and say "oh i didnt know about this and that" but our answer would be "its in the booklet" and your response would be "why didn't anyone tell me?"

You gett where we're going with this?

[SoLR]

NickC, on 17 October 2010 - 06:56 PM, said:

Don't generalize for your entire class. In addition, a freshman assembly was being held during the PSATs which is why Senior Info Session could not be held during that time. The only place that can fit well over 1000 students at any given moment is the Aud.

In addition, parents were also suppose to attend Senior Information Night as well which is why we hold it in the evening so parents can come right to Tech to meet up with their kid. Senior year is expensive. We hold this assembly every year to keep you and your parents in loop and to tell you what to expect. This is a time for students to discuss with their parents which events they want to attend and ways to fund those events. I know my mom pushed me to get a part time job to pay off those events because she told me that she wasn't going to take a cent out of my college fund.

When was the last time you read something the school gave you? Sure you may say now that giving out the pamphlet would suffice for having to stay 2 hours, but if we just did that, do you know how many kids would come up to 7C1 and say "oh i didnt know about this and that" but our answer would be "its in the booklet" and your response would be "why didn't anyone tell me?"

You gett where we're going with this?

Hey Nicky, just curious, were you at the assembly as well?

[lpj86]

It is impossible not to generallize the student body to a certain extent if you want to make a statement about the policies of our school. I think its a pretty fair generalization to assume that students who come in from 8 to 8:48 five days a week would not mind coming in at about the same time. If I am correct, the audotorium wasn't being used for anything else. I do think, however that it is an unfair generalization to think that students are incapable of understanding a panphlet, and discussing financial situations with their parent at home. The night itself was an outloud reading of the panphlet. The floor was not open to questions from the students, nor were any of the events really fleshed out. The first thing my friends and I did was burn through the panphlet, and then we sat there, bored. As far as student parent discussion goes, I am happy I didn't make my mom and brother go all the way to tech just so they could get information I had in a compact, less time consuming format. What is even worse of a generalization is that anyone who didn't go, didn't out of selfishness or laziness. Maybe more kids would have found ways to rearrange their obligations if they had known it wasn't simply a cut they were being threatened with. I can't help but wonder though, if Senior Info night was such an efficent way of getting out information, how are you so familliar with the behavior of uninformed seniors?